Religious Slaughter - Is it an Animal Welfare Issue? A Talk By CIWF

  • October 17, 2012 · 6:30 PM
  • This location is shown only to members

There is a lively discussion regarding vegetarianism/ meat eating below. The CLHG promotes free thinking and freedom of expression but we stress these opionions are those of individual members and do not reflect the group as a whole. We also stress this evenings debate is about religious slaughter methods and not vegetarianism, which could be a debate for another evening.

Halal meat is increasingly being served in restaurants, hospitals and work canteens in Britain. Should we be concerned about how religious slaughter affects the welfare of farm animals?

Vicky Bond from Compassion in World Farming presents the facts on the religious slaughter methods that produce both halal and kosher meat.

Her talk will hopefully provide some food for thought and some lively and interesting debate.

 

People are encouraged to arrive from 6.30 p.m. to have a glass of wine from our charity wine bar, chat to other members and take their seats.

The Talk will start at 7.00 p.m. prompt.

After Vicky’s lecture there will be a short question and answer session before we retire to the Enterprise pub nearby for further debate around 8.00 or 8.15 p.m.

A suggested donation of £2 would be welcome on the night towards the cost of room and equipment hire.

All CLHG talks are open to the general public.

 

Compassion in World Farming CIWF was founded in 1967 by British dairy farmer Peter Roberts who was concerned by the development of intensive factory farming. Today they campaign peacefully to end all cruel factory farming practices. Their passion is supported by hard evidence and facts which underpin their campaigns, and makes them leading experts in farm animal welfare.

 

Their political lobbying and campaigning has resulted in the EU recognising animals as sentient beings, capable of feeling pain and suffering. They have also secured landmark agreements to outlaw the barren battery cage for egg-laying hens, narrow veal crates and sow stalls across Europe.

 

Compassion in World Farming’s Food Business Team is working with some of the world’s biggest food retailers, producers and manufacturers. The companies they work with are a key part of the drive towards a more ethical and sustainable food supply. Their Good Farm Animal Welfare awards benefit millions of animals each year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Vicky Bond studied veterinary medicine at Liverpool University and intercalated it into a Masters at Sussex University in Environment Development and Policy. She undertook an internship at the Food Ethics Council. She then worked at Pig Business on a campaign for better labeling of pig meat, alongside a part-time veterinary surgeon position treating greyhounds and whippets.

Vicky joined CIWF in April 2011 as a research officer and works on all aspects of farming, including slaughter. She has also volunteers for  the charity Animal Care in Egypt for several years, which helps provide veterinary treatment for working equids.’

Join or login to comment.

  • Adam

    Yeah I heard about that study, it was totally botched and later studies have ripped it apart.

    October 18, 2012

  • James

    This is an interesting New Scientist article:
    http://bit.ly/3Ra09r

    Note at the bottom, there is reference to a 1978 study which I have actually seen cited as evidence that slaughter without stunning is better (on a Muslim website). But interestingly, it says that the guy who did the study warned that the experiments may not have functioned properly.

    October 18, 2012

  • James

    I had the same reply from a Jewish guy I asked. Now that science is emerging which seems to prove that pain continues after cutting, I'd like to know where they get their evidence for such a claim.

    October 18, 2012

  • A former member
    A former member

    I have many moslem neighbours who eat un-stunned meat. When asked they tell me that it is not cruel to kill an animal without stunning. I disagree.

    October 18, 2012

  • James

    It was an interesting presentation.

    While modern day kill methods have clearly improved in terms of reducing pain to the animal (captive bolt, gas), it seems like the religious slaughter traditions approach the entire process with more respect for the animal, as is commanded by their holy texts.

    Vicky explained that in practice however, there was generally little difference in treatment of the animals, from rearing to the actual slaughter, and that a religious label is no indication that the animal has been reared and treated any differently from more industrialised farming processes. I was very surprised by this.

    If part of the religious instruction is to care for and respect the animal, it appears the religious folk might have the upper hand when it comes to the animal's experience prior to slaughter, as a general guide.

    However, I am eager to know what evidence the religious folk cite when defending slaughter without stunning.

    October 18, 2012

  • David M.

    Many thanks for your support of the drinks table. We raised £66 for Compassion in World Farming.

    October 18, 2012

  • Sanch

    Working and studying til very late.. Will try and pop into the pub afterwards. I assume we'll be going!

    October 17, 2012

  • Andre

    Vegetarianism would be a very good thing to the planet. It would help combat global warming and world hunger, and there are many other benefits as far as our health is concerned. To say that slaughter can be humane is to introduce a slightly monstrous concept: humane slaughter. What about gentle theft? I mean, I'm just trying to draw attention to the effect produced by the putting together of the two words: humane slaughter. We are used to the idea of killing animals, and it doesn't occur to us that there is no polite way of killing a santient living being. It is a purely cultural convention. You wouldn't be so comfortable with the idea of killing dogs (even in the most painless way thinkable). We don't think that we absolutely must eat dogs. Cows and chickens, it seems, have different rights in our way of thinking. Unless of course you live in India! We don't kill animals because we've had a rational conversation about the ethical implications of doing so and then decided it was fine.

    1 · October 16, 2012

    • David M.

      Whilst the talk itself isn't about vegetarianism, I disagree with your slant as meat-eating is part of our evolutionary heritage, although it's then acquired different cultural tenets in different places. Given that it's a natural thing for us to do I think that humane slaughter is a reasonable concept, as is of course the debate as to why vegetarianism might be better for us and the planet. Less people would be better still (I'm single and planning to stay that way).

      October 17, 2012

    • Andre

      I disagree. Human beings are endowed with something quite unique by that same evolutionary process: the ability to go against what one might call natural. The reason for that is that it is also natural for us to be able to reason and indeed to understand, among many other things, that we've come about as a result of Evolution! We are perfectly capable of understanding (as it is obvious) that we don't have any need for meat. And, having understood that, we find ourselves in a position to ask whether eating meat is something desirable. If we didn't have the ability to make progress, we wouldn't have come to the point where we demand that women are given the same rights that have been for ever enjoyed by men, to mention just one example. You go a hundred years back and you find a very different picture. Finding the notion of humane slaughter odd is something very natural when you remember that we are naturally capable of thinking and learning in a way that no other animal is.

      1 · October 17, 2012

  • Adam

    The only convincing argument I've ever heard for kosher/halal slaughter being more ethical than secular slaughter is when the secular society in question happens to be the U.S., which has pretty appalling animal welfare standards last I checked.

    October 17, 2012

  • A former member
    A former member

    I completely agree with you David. Kristin

    October 17, 2012

  • James

    We cannot dismiss a religious way of slaughtering animals simply because it is religious. The real question is whether or not is the most humane way or the least cruel way. This is, hopefully, what this talk will be about.

    Vegetarianism is a separate issue.

    October 16, 2012

    • Helen

      Exaclty James on both counts. Looking forward to this debate tomorrow.

      October 16, 2012

  • James

    Not quite the same. I would like to know the real truth behind religious slaughter, because to be honest, if a particular religious slaughter method is actually less cruel than another, I'm all for it.

    October 16, 2012

    • asif

      yes i would love to know if there is any less cruel method of killing animals .

      October 16, 2012

  • Christina

    I've briefly looked through this discussion and can't see any examples of 'extreme prejudice', just expression of a minority viewpoint that is uncomfortable for many people to hear. Nor is it being justified in humanist terms. It just happens to be on a humanist meetup page...

    October 16, 2012

  • Behzad

    I would never imagine to face such an extreme prejudice in the name of Humanism. Obviously I was wrong!!!

    October 16, 2012

  • Behzad

    Thanks Brendan for providing the link.

    October 16, 2012

  • Brendan A.

    Though interesting and important the conversation about meat eating is, it is not the topic described for this talk.
    Here is a link to 6 essays argueing ethics of meat eating

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/04/20/magazine/ethics-eating-meat.html?src=tp

    But the topic of this talk is not meat eating vs vegan/ vegetarianism.
    I think this topic needs to be debated separately in order to give the subject the time it needs to get through the issues involved.

    October 16, 2012

  • Behzad

    With all respect, just because you are vegetarian you can't put prople who eat meat at same level as Nazis!!!

    October 16, 2012

  • Behzad

    Don't you think you go a bit too far.

    October 16, 2012

  • James

    I have been told on many occasions that religious animal slaughter, specifically in Judaism, is less cruel to the animal than secular slaughter. I am hoping this talk will shed light on the issue for me in a fair and balanced way.

    1 · October 16, 2012

  • Mark

    One thing that bothers me is that I CAN'T buy meat which is certified as having been slaughtered in a non-religious manner. Having been into several butchers (such as Dewhurst) and asked for "non-halal/non-kosher meat" I was told that most meat arrives at their shops from various distribution points and they couldn't be sure that the meat hadn't had some bearded nutjob chanting voodoo over the animal whilst it had its throat cut and was struggling and writhing in pain till its last breath. Why are we FORCED to eat animals that have endured an unnecessarily violent death?

    October 16, 2012

  • Andre

    I have just signed up to this group but I won't be able to attend this event: I have a lecture at exactly the same time.

    October 15, 2012

35 went

Our Sponsors

People in this
Meetup are also in:

Create your own Meetup Group

Get started Learn more
Rafaël

We just grab a coffee and speak French. Some people have been coming every week for months... it creates a kind of warmth to the group.

Rafaël, started French Conversation Group

Sign up

Meetup members, Log in

By clicking "Sign up" or "Sign up using Facebook", you confirm that you accept our Terms of Service & Privacy Policy