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RE: [DarwinsTavern] Six Things Christians Should Just Stop Saying

From: Steve S.
Sent on: Wednesday, April 3, 2013 6:44 AM
Fundamentalists are the more intellectually honest of the two groups, although both groups fudge on doctrines and Bible teachings which they find too credulous and/or unpalatable. The fundies are currently stuck on homosexuality=abomin­ation=sin=hellfire, but have been able to give up the belief in a flat earth and a geocentric universe, as two for instances.

"Liberal" Christians could be characterized as embryonic atheists, or atheists-in-training­ who haven’t made the complete metamorphic transition yet. Given the complete and embarrassing lack of a definitive hermeneutic used in formulating their cherry-picked beliefs, they will often come on over to the Dark Side at some point, because it's the logical thing to do. Fundies are acutely aware of this danger, which is why they stubbornly cling to absurd theological propositions...not because they find them so convincing, but because the alternative seems so terrifying to them...It's all about security...


-----Original Message-----
From: [address removed] [mailto:[address removed]] On Behalf Of Wade
Sent: Tuesday, April 02,[masked]:06 PM
To: [address removed]
Subject: Re: [DarwinsTavern] Six Things Christians Should Just Stop Saying

In SOME ways I do too.  But liberal Christans appreciate science and agree with me on social issues.  And in general I find them much more reasonable than fundies.


-----Original Message-----
From: Ellery Curtis <[address removed]>
To: darwinstavern-list <[address removed]>
Sent: Tue, Apr 2,[masked]:34 pm
Subject: Re: [DarwinsTavern] Six Things Christians Should Just Stop Saying




I think I have more in common with fundamentalists in some ways.

The fundi's search for internal consistency with their beliefs...they 
struggle with it, but they strive for it. 

If the bible cites homosexuality as a sin: 
http://skepticsan...­ - then well, it is a sin 
right?  For the fundi's the answer is clearly YES.

I have debated various liberal christians about their interpretation on 
the gay issue....and I find their apologetics on the subject confusing 
personally.  The bible in so many ways seems clear on that subject, in 
both the old and new testaments.  The fact that Jesus said nothing 
directly about it is not evidence.....

Another great example that comes to mind in the religion of my parents 
is the apologetics of black mormons:

http://www.blackl...­

The real conondrum is that previous mormon prophets have said racist 
crap...that black folks could not hold the priesthood because their 
lineage is cursed directly by god, per the scriptures (both old test. 
and book of mormon). 

So a prophet recieves such revelation on this subject....how do we 
black mormons reconcile this uncomfortable history - that god was once 
racist, but then in 1978 decided "meh, times change"?

Here is the answer:

"Obviously divine guidance does not depend upon historical context, but 
it seems clear from history that some revelations have been received by 
prophets in response to inquiries motivated by the surrounding social 
and political environment."

So these black mormons are ok with the idea that prophets can formally 
recieve "divine guidance" that is instead motivated not by god, but by 
"surrounding social and political environments".....

The question then is, if you are ok with that....why believe any of 
what they say is inspired by a deity?  Even If I accept that the bible 
or a prophet is in parts true, other parts not....how the hell do these 
people go about choosing which parts to find true and other parts 
bullshit? 

I suspect the way they determine this has everything to do with the 
"surrounding social and political environments"

I just dont get moderates...as soon as I became a moderate it all fell 
apart...the only way you can stay in that state is acceptance of 
massive amounts of ambiguity, contradictions, and almost total lack of 
logical consistency :D

--- On Tue, 4/2/13, Wade <[address removed]> wrote:


From: Wade <[address removed]>
Subject: [DarwinsTavern] Six Things Christians Should Just Stop Saying
To: [address removed]
Date: Tuesday, April 2, 2013, 8:31 AM



Hello primates!
Here's an interesting article from a liberal Christian perspective.  I 
have alot in common with liberal Christians, and I think this article 
highlights some of the common ground.  Note the "most and least 
Christians cities" in the US at the bottom.  Birmingham (according to 
these people) ranks 2nd in most Christian US cities with only Salt Lake 
City ahead of us.  And there is a wide gap between The Ham and number 
3.  But I have no idea about the accuracy of this list. 
http://www.huffin...­]
I hope to see you all on Friday!  So far we have a good number of 
RSVP's.  Don't let the construction deter you.  You'll get to see the 
new ballpark just a few days before it opens. 
Cheers!
---Wade 
 
 




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