The Illusion of Choice

Do we "truly" have the free will to make free choices?

Would we want to?

If ignorance can be bliss, would responsibility be pain?

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  • CRIS

    Hello all! I am new in this group, when is the next met up?
    Thanks!

    November 15, 2012

  • Cathal G.

    Great evening and a discussion!

    November 2, 2012

  • Jonathan D.

    I think it's more important to consider a persons childhood. Those who don't think free will exists, were you raised by authoritarian and controlling parents?

    October 31, 2012

    • Jonathan D.

      as Socrates said*

      November 1, 2012

    • A former member
      A former member

      i was raised to be free with morality based on globally recognized thinkers and philosophers views not religious morality

      1 · November 1, 2012

  • Pedro

    Hi All,
    we are not booking any table at Gresham's. We usually sit at the back left wing of the lobby. Hope to see you all there

    Best regards

    November 1, 2012

  • Slavomir M.

    Well, the answer of the question weather I have a free will, or I don't have it probably depends on how I define "I", how I define my very identity. If I am something completely separated from my environment, from the rest of the Universe, there are just too many things, events, circumstances, etc... which limit me, influence me, determinate me. However, if there is no real, clear, sharply cut difference between me and the world, if everything is me... there is nothing left to limit me or influence me. I tend to believe that the latter case is true... that separation and multiplicity are just a very persistant illusion.

    October 27, 2012

    • A former member
      A former member

      Again I say this ; those who are in control cannot offer free will because they are technologically retarded , they can control only if they divided populations into semi army units , armies usually have definite vocal orders and very much predictable, easily could be defeated and controlled by primitive computerized equipments , unlike individuals , that’s why French avoid speaking English in France , for example , because it would confuse these equipments and provoke such unit programming therefore no free will is given to the French to speak English in France (this is an example not to be taken literally)

      1 · October 27, 2012

    • A former member
      A former member

      ,…. another thing is ; if Hitler did evil , then , those morons , those retarded gangs who controlled the world after the year 1945 , those technologically retarded gangs who are unable to offer free will , are doing each and every day more evil things than what took Hitler a life time to do

      1 · October 28, 2012

  • A former member
    A former member

    There is no such thing as complete freedom and therefore complete free will

    October 23, 2012

    • A former member
      A former member

      That idea was enforced only after the year 1945 when military strategies that won the war were implemented on civilians,nations are frightened to question such issues, if free will cannot be offered now it is because those who control people destinies lack the ability,the morals ,and the good intentions to rule over civilians

      1 · October 23, 2012

  • Robert

    Hey Pedro I did notice that I picked Thursday as opposed to the normal Wednesday it's slightly more convenient for me but I have no issues with changing it to better suit everyone.

    To Osama I will address one point.

    "provide free will".

    How or why should I demand to be provided with free will.
    What power is there to enact this demand, not from the will-less there isn't.
    "Each one has as much right as his power is worth" - Spinoza
    quantum potentia valere creditur

    October 17, 2012

    • Pedro

      Hey Robert. I'm OK with it... Really busy lately and not completely sure I'll attend, so better to keep your agenda. Thanks for organizing this

      October 17, 2012

    • A former member
      A former member

      Free will is a basic human right, humans are born with it and so other creatures, similar to being born with two hands, two legs, one head, etc, you were born with these body parts, they are not negotiated to be given to people after birth
      Controlling such right is introduced , then , by some others who may claim superiority, superiority is something that is being questioned and investigated , free will is the reason why you ever existed , further more , it is the reason why millions of European moved to America and constructed countries that exist nowadays , then consequently , formed organizations probably after the year 1945 , such organizations are claiming superiority over the free world , controlling or depriving people from their basic rights , this include free will
      ----
      "Each one has as much right as his power is worth", such statement does not talk about basic human rights, and if it does, it is false statement

      2 · October 17, 2012

  • Ide

    Good topic choice Robert..I shall be there 

    October 17, 2012

  • A former member
    A former member

    Is this free??

    October 17, 2012

    • Pedro

      Yes it is. But you can contribute one euro for the costs of maintaining this group in meetup.com

      October 17, 2012

  • A former member
    A former member

    To start with , there are no illusion of choice ; you say this because you are colonizers and aggressors , evil entities , evil gods (if you say that you are gods) , the worst power ever found on earth , you are asking for total obedience and offer no options because it is the only way that you can control destinies of future generations.
    What should be basic human rights (free choice) had become illusion because of your incompetence and inability to provide proper convincing options, your aggressions to control, your greed and savageness
    - Those in control or those who claim to be in charge are doing a bad job, humans or gods on the ground or in the sky , unworthy gods and unworthy organizations those who cannot provide free will to make free choice

    October 17, 2012

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