London Atheist Activist Group (informal community) Message Board 1. MAIN FORUM - (non-Islam) › Yes we are smarter and that's another thing we shouldn't be shy in sharing

Yes we are smarter and that's another thing we shouldn't be shy in sharing

Adrian
KingHell
Group Organizer
London, GB
Post #: 906
Modesty is not a virtue. At best it's misleading, at worst a lie. We are the more intelligent that's a simple fact. We shouldn't be shy about bringing it up and being proud of it (pride is a virtue - taking pride in one's work for example).

It's like this: Do you believe in fairy tales? No. Well hardly surprisingly you're more intelligent than people who do. Decades of research in 63 studies. My suggestion is those that don't believe this study are even less intelligent still.

eligious people are less intelligent than atheists, study finds
Georgi L.
Guffaw
London, GB
Post #: 2,155
Apparently doesn't help typing skills though biggrin

Pride isn't a virtue in my book btw. Pride in one's work really means being diligent? For the sake of one's own satisfaction and/or for the benefit of others. But yes, certainly more legitimate when you've done something to be proud of rather than for an accident of birth/inherent attribute.

Agree modesty isn't (mostly) a virtue, but I'm not sure crowing about atheists being more intelligent than the religious is going to help anything?
Adrian
KingHell
Group Organizer
London, GB
Post #: 907
Who's crowing? Did I mention crowing? I didn't mention crowing lol. and by the way typing schmyping!

I am just a bit tired of that sad old line, which I've never liked and never understood: "nobody likes a smart arse". Yes they do - every time they need someone smart around. I wondered if it was all part of that vicious circle where (and don't confuse 'educated' with 'intelligent') people with better educations would snobbishly say "oh, don't you know what 'xyz' is?" as if it was some sort of crime to not know something (perhaps another social rubber stamp for pretending to know what you don't know). I think the "nobody likes a smart arse phrase comes from that same old destructive cycle of class snobbery /inverted snobbery.

We shouldn't be shy about being smart. It's anything but a crime! In fact the irony is that means intelligence, not being the same thing as education, makes it all the more ironic for the religious. We are atheists because we're intelligent enough to have smelled a rat in the whole religion thing: it's obviously a load of bollocks. However the religious, presented with this data, must assume that it is in fact their god who doesn't like a smart arse, and that why he made them all thick. Ay thank you.
sandra
user 8153883
London, GB
Post #: 9
so you aren't swayed by the 'no free will' argument? Been reading a bit about that lately- cos if pride is uncalled for in a caused universe then so is shame and I could get a load of that! I suppose pride smacks of better than you with my god given talent, gift. We should definitely value ourselves, dare I say love ourselves? (vomiting now?) I always thought I just wasn't clever enough to understand the 'deepities' or to practise the doublethink required, whereas truth is just easy, obvious. I think if you tell someone you are cleverer than them they beat you up! BTW, weren't you lovely organisers going to host a talk on Free Will?
A former member
Post #: 121
I agree we should be proud of our intelligence however it was nice to hear Dawkins make a very good point in his interview with Boggo that too many people filll their sentences with big words to try and sound smart. This often detracts from the message and sometimes make it impossible to ubderstand. The words we use should be consice enough to efficiently communicate the subject and intent.
Georgi L.
Guffaw
London, GB
Post #: 2,157
so you aren't swayed by the 'no free will' argument? Been reading a bit about that lately- cos if pride is uncalled for in a caused universe then so is shame and I could get a load of that! I suppose pride smacks of better than you with my god given talent, gift. We should definitely value ourselves, dare I say love ourselves? (vomiting now?) I always thought I just wasn't clever enough to understand the 'deepities' or to practise the doublethink required, whereas truth is just easy, obvious. I think if you tell someone you are cleverer than them they beat you up! BTW, weren't you lovely organisers going to host a talk on Free Will?
I think shame and guilt are largely religious ideas, that are meant to hound and control you. For us I think they can be learning mechanism but then we should try and discard them, ...er without guilt.

We had to switch the free will talk with the talk about Unitarianism, so it's has been moved to March, but will definitely be coming.

Paul: "Boggo", how very antipodean, LOL!
Adrian
KingHell
Group Organizer
London, GB
Post #: 908
Well talking about cause and effect Sandra, I'd say that pride comes before a fall is no truer than crossing the road comes before being run over. We all talk about naming and shaming, and that's fair enough under the banner of transparency, but shame in the religious sense is normally for things you can't necessarily control - it's a twisted part of imposed morals isn't it? I haven't given this much consideration so that's a bit train-of-thought.

Anyway, yes, we will be doing the free will talk early next year (11th March). It had to be postponed due to work commitments for Jason who will be presenting that particular talk. We have a speaker coming to talk about Unitarianism next month (that still gets a capital letter at the moment - I tend to drop the caps for things/people I have no respect for ;-)
Georgi L.
Guffaw
London, GB
Post #: 2,158
If we are lucky enough to have the genes and conditions to come to atheism, is that something to be proud of though? I agree that if you had to free yourself from indoctrination, social pressure etc, then yes it probably is, but otherwise I'd say it's a cause to feel lucky rather than proud.

I also dislike phrases like "proud to be Australian". Accident of birth - one might say we were privileged, in the same way that our unelected feudal overlords are privileged - just an accident of birth, and not your own accomplishment.

I agree that we shouldn't be hiding our intelligence or feeling guilty in some way, but really not sure about pride. Pride is seldom justified when you really think about it.
Roger
user 33309642
London, GB
Post #: 468
Surely the point is not that you become smarter if you're an atheist smile rather that people with a good level of education are slightly more likely to escape early religious conditioning (if indeed they had such)?
Martyn
Maradam
Guildford, GB
Post #: 820
Beware arrogance.

There are several different kinds of 'smart'.
Powered by mvnForum

Optional Contribution

GBP10.00 to laag.events@gmail.com

This covers: This is to help with LAAG's activism and the Ministry of Reason project.

Payment is accepted using:

  • PayPal
  • Cash or check - “Please email us and we'll send details. Or see us at any LAAG own meetup (i.e. not EXTERNAL events etc.) Again if in doubt email us.

Refunds are not offered for this Meetup.

People in this
Meetup are also in:

Sign up

Meetup members, Log in

By clicking "Sign up" or "Sign up using Facebook", you confirm that you accept our Terms of Service & Privacy Policy