Skeptics of Tucson Message Board › NDE: The Living Dead

NDE: The Living Dead

John T.
user 5081321
Tucson, AZ
Post #: 9
I recently received a message from a believer suggesting that I check an article on near death experiences - NDE (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article5324234.ece­). I have never gotten anywhere in conversation on this topic with this person and he has been one of those who claim I "disrupt the energy field" and this accounts for the fact I cannot see the error of my ways.

I have always thought NDE was linked to a variety of effects that have been explored associated with out-of-body experiences (OBE) in the conventional scientific community along several different lines. The only effect reported in NDE that seems to be different from the accumulating body of research is the ability to "see" things not visible to the "nearly dead" body. I guess these are what would be considered conventional clairvoyant abilities were it not for the circumstances of the acute medical condition.

It might interesting to have a meeting devoted to a discussion of these beliefs. If you are interested, you might want to read a recent paper on OBE that was also written up in the popular press (http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0003832­).

John
Andrew
user 2751251
Los Angeles, CA
Post #: 111
Hi John,

I read all those articles. They are long and I read them a while ago so I can't remember all the details. I have also read many other articles and watched many other movies about this subject, so I can't keep them all separated any more. I am too lazy to reread them all again also. I would definitely like to discuss the topic at a meeting.

I don't believe that NDE people can see things not visible to nearly dead bodies. Many times people will guess things that happen to turn out to be true, or they merely repeat things, that they heard others talking about while they were under. When they then recall things, they could not have known in great detail, people believe something 'spiritual' is happening. In fact, their brain subconsciously heard others talking about what was going on and then they recounted that. The rational and logical explanation is always the most plausible to me. It is just easier and more exciting to think up magical and spiritual answers.

Andrew
user 2751251
Los Angeles, CA
Post #: 114
I propose that our next Skeptic Topic be:

"Near Death Experiences"

There are so many videos that address this. Comedy from Penn and Tellers Bulls-hit, brain research etc all relate to this. I know I have given this topic a lot of thought, as have probably many others.

I believe the NDE is a huge gateway to religion, as are magical thinking, fantasy prone personalities, drugs, stress, altered states of consciousness, mental illness and brain trauma. Science and skepticism can put these things in perspective and counteract the negative effects of these powerful life events.

I would especially like to discuss the questions, facts and or thoughts one must consider in order to put such experiences into perspective. What sort of data could a believer learn, that would let them take a step back and reconsider all their new age mumbo jumbo beliefs? That would be interesting. I already know that all the skeptics will agree with me that NDE's are merely vivid dream states of the brain under extreme stress. No skeptic believes that the NDE is an encounter with God or the spiritual realm. But believers do see NDE as proof for God and spirituality. How could we get a believer to reconsider their conclusions? That would be interesting to discuss.
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