addressalign-toparrow-leftarrow-rightbackbellblockcalendarcameraccwchatcheckchevron-downchevron-leftchevron-rightchevron-small-downchevron-small-leftchevron-small-rightchevron-small-upchevron-upcircle-with-checkcircle-with-crosscircle-with-pluscrossdots-three-verticaleditemptyheartexporteye-with-lineeyefacebookfolderfullheartglobegmailgoogleimageimagesinstagramlinklocation-pinmagnifying-glassmailminusmoremuplabelShape 3 + Rectangle 1outlookpersonplusprice-ribbonImported LayersImported LayersImported Layersshieldstartickettrashtriangle-downtriangle-uptwitteruseryahoo
A former member
Post #: 84
phl
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 36
Comrades!
Feverishly I work day and night to respond. Two places of especially interesting study are:
1.The Giants of Russian Literature:Turgenev,Dostoevsky,Tolstoy,C­hekhov (Liza Knapp)
This sample of audio lessons is FANTASTICSKI!

2."The Voices of Legion: The Narrator of The Possessed.
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 37
Ok now you're caught up...kind of.
I love your stuff. Really-you are a fine and challenging reader/thinker. Love it. Thanks
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 38
I'm on your wavelength...I'm thinking of each character and the way in which each one is presented as obsessed-or as having one main idea,book,poem,-ism-
I'll keep working on it too...
and so goodnight little grasshopper-
Jun Bae S.
user 95933042
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 1
From this novel and my experience, I realize that a human being might be supposed to suffer from social and existential nothingness, which is a human bondage. While social- and existential nothingness are separate, they are not easily separated and often confused. Paradoxically, what makes life nothingness is also to make life beautiful. - Suppose we live forever. Then this foreverness makes us miserable somehow. - We have our own dream, or dream of dream, because we could be something when we dream.

- I guess, in the book, Lebyatkin shows social nothingness. He tried to forget his nothingness with drinking. His nothingness makes him abuse his sister. When he abuses his sister, he could be something powerful. Abuse might often occur in close relationship. He might be addicted to abuse.

This book reminds us often of Albert Camus (and his philosophy) who mentioned Kirilov in his book. But, I would like to recommend you to take a look at Viktor Frankl, who invents logotheraphy, http://en.wikipedia.o...­.
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 39
Penetrating and insightful, Jun! I have much to say-I'm working on it. More later.
Jun Bae S.
user 95933042
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 2
No Dostoevsky's book in Oprah's list.

I happen to find no Dostoevsky's book in Oprah Winfrey's list of books, while there are Dickens', Tolstoy and Steinbeck. One might say, it could be Oprah's personal preference. However, when main characters of Dostoevsky's books are recalled, it can be observed that each main character in his book asks theological and philosophical questions. In particular, in this novel, we can see that Stavrogin has no life and no emotional attachment to anything.
We could have life, if we are emotionally attached to something. - Stavrogin does not even show emotional relationship to his mother-

Before we find answers to some philosophical questions regarding to existence and God, we have to get through our own daily life, such as job, love, care, jealousy, parent, drug, abuse, divorce, orphan, even dystopia (from books of Oprah's list). In getting through all these things, we are naturally attached to these with our emotion and reason.
I might not be able to answer to my philosophical question regarding to existence. I found nothing rationally explained. But, if I add up all things I have been through - in dealing with these things, ironically I might look for God - , that sum could show my (empirical) existence. I think that many books in Oprah's list tell those stories, which is life.

I think I talk too much biggrin
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 40
What did I miss? Why Oprah's list?
You have certainly given me much to think about. No. You do NOT talk too much. More! More!

I read the Frankl. Yes. I learn much from him. Those who have been through much have much to teach.
I twigged on your "a human bondage...".
Speaking of Somerset Maugham-brilliant. This link connects to a thought-provoking outline which leads us right to our Dostoevskyty.http://www.us.penguin...­
And at the bottom of the page: Should we read Dreiser? or Sons and Lovers?
Jun Bae S.
user 95933042
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 3
Thank Regi for the link.

As for Oprah's list, I just wondered why there is no Dostoevsky's book in her list. Main themes of Dostoevsky's books seem quite philosophical and psychologically insightful, which can be applied to our time. But, I think that the questions that Dostoevsky explored seem experimental. Our life, however, is an experiment (or journey) itself, which we can't do it again. We often wanted, but we have to move on. Books in Oprah's list show those experiments, which someone else might share with.

The post of mentioning Oprah's list is off the topic of 'Demons'. I just would like to share what I happened to realize. biggrin

Returning to this book, I think that by Stavrogin, Dostoevsky seems tried to make a human being above good and evil (as he did in other novels.)
Due to conscience and empathic capability of human being, we are not free from doing anything. I think that Dostoevsky often implies, because of God, we can not do that. In other words, without God, we could do anything.
- Ironically, throughout human history, we did irrespective of such arguments.-

In his novels, making a human being free from good and evil leads to make his heroes socio-path. His heroes finally couldn't be free, but just lost empathic capability and isolated from his society. When a human being recovers such empathy (returning to God?), guilty conscience and remorse are enormous, which is hard to bear. The last chapter of this book, At Tikhon's, shows one another variant of this pattern.
Regi M.
Regwords
Vancouver, BC
Post #: 41
­In his novels, making a human being free from good and evil leads to make his heroes socio-path. His heroes finally couldn't be free, but just lost empathic capability and isolated from his society. When a human being recovers such empathy (returning to God?), guilty conscience and remorse are enormous, which is hard to bear. The last chapter of this book, At Tikhon's, shows one another variant of this pattern.

(Thanks Jun)

Now your comments here are applicable both to The Picture of Dorian Gray and to Of Human Bondage.
And,since it is Franz Kafka's 130th birthday,let us not forget the lessons taught(?) by Metamorphosis. (The META is for Ee Lyn,who claims to fear theoretical physics).

Interesting...how amazed Kafka,Wilde,and Dostoevsky might be to realize that after all their suffering and peregrinations,they will live to be several hundred years old.
Powered by mvnForum

People in this
Meetup are also in:

Sign up

Meetup members, Log in

By clicking "Sign up" or "Sign up using Facebook", you confirm that you accept our Terms of Service & Privacy Policy