Orange County NY Preppers Message Board › EMP......What If?

EMP......What If?

Jake G.
user 145300652
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 1
I had mentioned at the last meeting (my first) a prepper game that I thought would be good to play during meetings as it would aid in the group getting to know each other as well as allow each of us (and as a group) to consider scenarios. I will bring some questions to the next meeting (though I think no more than one question per meeting is wise). I thought I'd post one for discussion in the mean time. So here we go....

You are at a business convention 1200 miles away from your family when an EMP goes off and stops the entire civilization in it’s tracks. None of the means of communications or transportation work, the banking system and all the comforts of modern civilization are broken, setting the entire country back hundreds of years. Infrastructure won’t be fixed anytime soon and you aren’t ready for this. You have $300 in your pocket and a few hours before all shelves are empty. Would you stay local or head for home? Whatever your decision is, what would you buy with the money and why?
Richard
user 73153112
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 1
Good question. I personally would head home to my family, if everything went down then there safty is in trouble.
Rick
Frank
user 118765812
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 3
If it was an EMP, how would you know what happened unless you were where the EMP attack occurred which would mean falloutso you would die before you made it home? I would search for dry foods, life straw, poncho, para chord, compass and a survival knife at a nearby sporting goods. Then try to find a way home.
Sean
smaley
Monroe, NY
Post #: 100
You are at a business convention 1200 miles away from your family when an EMP goes off and stops the entire civilization in it’s tracks. None of the means of communications or transportation work, the banking system and all the comforts of modern civilization are broken, setting the entire country back hundreds of years. Infrastructure won’t be fixed anytime soon and you aren’t ready for this. You have $300 in your pocket and a few hours before all shelves are empty. Would you stay local or head for home? Whatever your decision is, what would you buy with the money and why?
I think the idea would be to get home, of course. However, there would be numerous other factors determining if that were even possible. If home is here in NY, being 1200 miles away you might hold off getting home when it's the middle of the winter. Securing a water bottle, filter, knife, and bicycle would be a priority to eventually doing so, but what would $300 mean in a societal collapse? Better spend it quickly before everyone realizes it means nothing.

Where you were located 1300 miles away might also be a factor. It might be more realistic to travel by water if you can find a sail boat. If there are mountains in the way, a bike may not be as realistic for part of the journey. How long in a given area before they run out of food and become desperate? Maybe waiting for warm weather means gangs camped on highways waiting for a bike to steal. Maybe we can have a specific location where the convention happened.

Orlando Florida? That's 1200 miles up to the Catskills, or about. I'd be thinking about a boat to get home in those circumstances. I bet a few others would too.
Jake G.
user 145300652
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 2
Great discussion guys.

Frank, the detonation of a nuclear bomb would be only one possible cause of an EMP, there are others which would negate any threat of fallout. Also, it would be possible to (depending on the geography) see the tell tail mushroom cloud, yet be more than far enough away to not be in the blast radius or even the extended area of radiation. I don't know if the bomb were detonated well above a location, say the Gulf of Mexico, how much of radiation, if any would be a threat, but I am no expert.

Sean, as for a location. I'd say for sake of discussion, we each pick our own. maybe based on locations where we are likely to be. I will say, lets say as for time of year, it's late June.

Let me draw this out a bit and ask a question. For those who have immediate family, wife, husband, children, do you believe there is an option not to go home? Said another way, do you believe you have an obligation to to get home to provide for and protect your family?

For me, getting home to my family is a priority, in fact, I believe there is a moral imperative that I go home. As for scenario, I'll say I'm in the mid-west, say, NE Texas(beyond 1200 miles). I'm going to assume I have a means of defense of some kind (it is Texas after all). I too would get some kind of water container, and if possible a Lifestraw or the like. Being I'm inept at making fire, I would get some kind of fire making tool, be it a lighter, flint, whatever I can, and probably not one type (1 is none, 2 is 1 ). I'd also get a decent knife (though I never go anywhere without one..and a flashlight), a tarp or heavy duty garbage bags, a backpack and the best cord I can get. The bags can provide shelter, and act as a poncho. I'd also grab some power bars or the like, the smallest size, with the highest calories possible. Maybe a few boxes of Jello for quick energy. A bicycle sounds good, though there is no reason a lot of motorcycles wouldn't work. Now can I buy a motor cycle for $200 or so? Not likely, but there is always the possibility someone rather have the cash, in this scenario, than a bike. But these are variables we can't truly prepare for, because they are utterly beyond our control. Being we are in June, and I'm likely dressed for warm weather, so I'd pick up a warm coat, because there is a strong possibility I don't make it home till Winter or even Spring.

I might initially travel along the railroad tracks. I don't know that I'd expect many folks on them in the first week. Not to mention, it's possible the trains would be working. But I'd be extremely cautious because again, this is one of those things that is beyond our control. This isn't mathematics, so though we may expect this or that, there is no guarantee. So keeping an open mind and our heads on a swivel, is essential to survival.

Look forward to further discussion...

Sean
smaley
Monroe, NY
Post #: 101
"Now can I buy a motor cycle for $200 or so?"

Dude! If you can get a motorcycle to function after an EMP, why wouldn't a car, train, or plane still be an option?

Getting home beginning in June would be an ideal option and begs the potential that you wouldn't have to rely on fire to do so unless you tried to walk the whole way. A bicycle could get you 50-200 miles per day depending upon conditioning and terrain, and it doesn't require electronic functions to operate.

This is starting to sound like an unrealistic dialog. I would be attempting to get "home" because it's home. I suppose "provide for and protect", but that spins this dialog in a funny way. Wouldn't you *emotionally* want to be with family? You prepared at "home", so wouldn't you want to return to where you have so much survivability established? It's where you are invested, emotionally, socially, and physically. I also don't think cash will have value once you know your plane tickets aren't going to be helpful, or renting a car. The default of hiking might get you home for Halloween.

Even coming up from NYC to Orange County could take several days when you start talking walking. A week or two into an event that forces folks to walk out of cities, and we're too far for them to survive the hike without adequate preparation. On a bicycle, they can make it in one grueling day, given the extra daylight in June, or training. I suspect we won't get many bicyclists making their way up either. You need to be an early abandon-er should you find yourself in a city of any meaningful size, which means you're vulnerable to hiking home when you could've just rescheduled the flight, a few times.

This *is* mathematics. 1200 miles by bike = ~ 10 days. 1200 miles by foot = 120 days. 1200 miles by horse = ~ 12 days.

Avoid major cities, as rural areas will be either less desperate or more likely already knocked off (emergency supplies go to high populations/wealth pools first, but rural areas are more likely to prep with less people to defend it against). Are you going to spend your time on a highway or looking for defense perimeters protecting something should you have nothing and get hungry?
Jake G.
user 145300652
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 3
Well, an EMP effects the electronics in an automobile. Certain motor cycles (as well as cars) would not have electronics that control the engine or anything that would be required for the vehicle to function.

As for the value of money. I suspect that in the first couple of days of such an event, the sheep will not suspect what is going on and will seek to take advantage. My assumption in this is I am moving within hours of this event, which could allow my money to be valuable, to at least some.

The getting home to family part really for me is to engage in conversation with those in the group to hear what is guiding each of us. Lone rangers? Moral? Sacrificial? Tyrants? These are highly important traits to know.

So with that in mind, for me, regardless of what supplies may be at "home", getting to my family is a moral imperative. Now, this imperative does not come with ignorance, but it does say I must get home. So, I need to find the fastest way home that also is the least risky.

A motorcycle (dirt bike) would be my first choice, and I believe would be the best means of transportation. It's maneuverable, economic in terms of fuel, able to ride on and off road. Down sides would be, being exposed, whether to the elements or others, it's likely louder than a car, and doesn't allow for a lot of storage.

A bicycle is better than walking. It's quiet, it may allow for more storage than walking, and it requires me as fuel, which puts extra burden on my food and water (if I have any), but also could allow for me to be more isolated, in terms of roads. It's also slow, and leaves be exposed, with very little room for error. On a motorcycle at least I can gain speed, with a bike, not so much.

If I had a motorcycle, to be honest, I would have to at least, risky as it is, to try some interstates. Obviously there are so many variables in this. What time did this EMP go off, is it during a Holiday, what was the weather? All these things will play a role in how many people may be on the road. Either way, I'm still taking a look. But again, I'm assuming I'm on the road before 24hrs has past.

Anyway....good talk...

Sean
smaley
Monroe, NY
Post #: 102
http://www.futurescie...­

<Cars dying: Some say that all vehicles traveling will come to a halt, with all modern vehicles damaged because of their use of modern electronics (and one movie even had a bulk, non-electronic part dying). Most likely there will be some vehicles affected, but probably just a small fraction of them (although this could create traffic jams in large cities). A car does not have very long cabling to act as antennas, and there is some protection from metallic construction. As non-metallic materials are used more and more in the future to decrease weight and increase fuel efficiency, this advantage may disappear.>
Jake G.
user 145300652
Newburgh, NY
Post #: 4
Great article.....I've heard this before, and this is why preparing for such things is so difficult (and frustrating). When I hear words like "most likely", I'm reminded we are not dealing with absolutes, but probabilities. So it seems the wisdom of redundancy is once again, the rule for the day.
Marion
user 40521102
Mahopac, NY
Post #: 1
I think I agree with smaleys response the most. So we are all supposed to be preppers here and what I am reading is 'finding' supplies in the business location (example: food-powerbars, water, para cord, knife, map, compass, walking shoes-sneakers and socks, flashlight, cash, poncho, backpack, first aid kit/bandaids and burn cream) -- these are items you should be traveling with at all times. 10 miles or 1,200 miles from home. And you should have a plan for you and your family. One of the plan items I remind my family about is if you move from one location to another, to write on the house/door with marker when you left and where you are going next, this way they know you were there and know you are moving on to next location. Circumstances will rule everything. Key is to remain 'invisible', keep a low key journey home interacting with as few people as possible. A bicycle or boat would be beneficial but someone who wants it will take it. They will want anything you have. Be prepared to walk. Stay focused, get rest if you can and have a strategy. This will be survival, not a game. Your plan should include check point/meeting points, stick to them no matter how long it takes to get home. Unless an entire portion of the country is taken out, you will work your way home. Be smart, calculating every move, don't trust anyone. As a woman this will be additionally a concern, maybe travel home with a business colleague that is of the same mind.
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