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The London Atheists Meetup Group Message Board The London Atheists Meetup Group Discussion Forum › prospective MP's flying start

prospective MP's flying start

Barry R.
user 10723166
London, GB
Post #: 11
On Saturday 10th of April I received a 'flyer' through the door from our new/prospective Labour MP John Cryer. (The previous incumbent - Harry Cohen - will be 'standing down' after the recent expenses revelations.)

In this leaflet, Cryer pledged to meet with 'faith groups' should he be returned at the next election.

I took the opportunity to email him in order to register my dismay. Here's what I wrote:

Hi John,

I would like to offer a personal comment although it is not related to any of the above issues. I would like to take this opportunity to say something about one of your pledges made in a recent flyer that came through my door. If my comment is deemed to be 'off topic' I shall understand if you delete it.

Your declared willingness to attend meetings held by 'faith groups' was hugely disappointing - though depressingly unsurprising.

You might be surprised to learn just how many others like myself long for the day when those who represent us locally and nationally decline to engage with people of 'faith'.

Had you declared yourself willing to engage with 'knowledge' and/or 'experience' groups I (and many others) would have had no hesitation in supporting you.

Thanks for reading.

Barry Ryder

My comment appeared straight away on the web page. By Sunday morning it had been removed.

Very depressing, don't you think?


Ed M.
user 6898352
London, GB
Post #: 357
Yes its just about what I would have expected

Some time ago I wrote to Frank Dobson(Labour, Holborn) about Sharia Law
in the UK and was told in effect that I was making a fuss about nothing
tell that to the Muslim women who have broken away from Islam

But when I wrote to him about the purposed ant-Gay Law in Uganda, he was very positive
in support of what I said, but perhaps thats because the people who would be upset by him taking a stand in favour
of Gay Rights in a far away country don't have a vote in Holborn

I'm afraid its naive to expect a principled stand from any representative of the main parties
as they are all convinced that religion deserves special respect event those who in private concede that they are not religious

Barry R.
user 10723166
London, GB
Post #: 13
Hi Ed,

thanks for your thoughts.

I (grudgingly) accept your observation that it was naive of me - you're right, of course.

I was thinking of finding out just how committed this candidate is to 'faith groups'.

If I were to invite him to meet with me and my local 'Loch Ness Kennedy Assassination Alien Abductee 911 emotional support group', would he come, do you think?

Ed M.
user 6898352
London, GB
Post #: 359
Well Barry how many members(voters) have you got
Peter F.
user 10387965
Maidstone, GB
Post #: 73
Hi Barry,

I got the same Leaflet I live in E11, Leytonstone :)

I was thinking about taking this approach to the vote canvassers :

Q. Who will you be voting for on the 6th May ?
A. I am an Atheist , what Pro-Atheist policies do you have to tempt me to vote for you?
Q. What policies did you have in mind?
i. Will you be banning Faith Schools ?

ii. Will you remove the Tax Exempt status of Faith-Based Organisations, including any voluntary donations?

iii. Will you Bring Faith Based organizations and their Places of Worship in line with The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 which came into force on 26 May 2008 ? IE: They must clearly display a disclaimer stating "entertainment only" and their work is not "experimentally proven" , both outside and inside the Churches, Mosques, Temples, Chapels, Synagogues etc and on all their literature.

iv. Will you Protect children from Religious indoctrination and allow the child the Freedom to manifest his or her own religion and beliefs as per the Convention on the Rights of the Child Article 14 ? – What actions will you take to ensure the child manifest his or her own religion and not that of the parents as is the case in most households? ( Would you consider raising the age of admittance to places of worship to 18? )

v. Will you allow any tax-payers money to fund visits by religious leaders, such as the Popes visit in 2010?

vi. What is your timetable for banning the full-face veil in public places?

A former member
Post #: 500
They must clearly display a disclaimer stating "entertainment only" and their work is not "experimentally proven"

Nice. I like it biggrin

Barry R.
user 10723166
London, GB
Post #: 14
Woah, yes!

I like that, too.

If you don't mind, Peter, I'll cut-paste-and print that delightful list of posers. I'll keep it by the front door - along with my 'JW repellent literature kit'.

Peter F.
user 10387965
Maidstone, GB
Post #: 74
I think I will hand-deliver a letter to their shop/office in the High Street . With that questionnaire and a Stamped addressed envelope for their reply ! biggrin

The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 ‘ - it already covers Tarot card readers, clairvoyants and psychics ( Astrologists ), maybe someone knows why faith groups are excluded - is it because they are funded by voluntary donations ? Or because they are a not-for-profit organisation? But then again many of them sell a service, like marriages, funerals and Baptisms, with promises of
You marriage has been blessed by God. ‘
‘ Your departed loved one has gone to a better place. ‘

Both of which are ‘ not experimentally proven ‘.

Convention on the Rights of the Child Article 14

Article 14 : Freedom of thought, conscience and religion

1. States Parties shall respect the right of the child to freedom of thought, conscience and religion.

2. States Parties shall respect the rights and duties of the parents and, when applicable, legal guardians, to provide direction to the child in the exercise of his or her right in a manner consistent with the evolving capacities of the child.

3. Freedom to manifest one's religion or beliefs may be subject only to such limitations as are prescribed by law and are necessary to protect public safety, order, health or morals, or the fundamental rights and freedoms of others.

At first it seems to be promoting religion. But since 90% of kids inherit their parents’ religion they are not manifesting their own religion and thus their right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion is be being hindered / compromised by parental Indoctrination .
Ed M.
user 6898352
London, GB
Post #: 363
You are right, its saying the the rights of the Child can only be exercised via the parents
which is not giving the child protection from the parents which is what most of are getting at in opposing Faith Schools

Religious Parents will always think they know whats best for the Child in the realm of religion
and certainly wont respect their right to choose a different path

The fact that so many adult atheists wont come out to their parents proves my point
and I cant see any politicians standing up and saying that the parental rights are violating those of the child
It becomes serious when the state respects the rights of the parents to refuse medical treatment or
just preventative treatment like cervical cancer vaccine injections
Sue M
London, GB
Post #: 1,866
Thanks Peter - for your usual constructive and helpful ideas. I have circulated your list of questions to our membership a facility I use sparingly, hope to good effect. I thought it worth starting a new post for the purpose.
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