I feel like I have hijacked this discussion, so I will only add my final thoughts on this matter (unless someone wants to ask me a question).  I was religious most of my life, and only very recently became an atheist.  I have learned that being skeptical is good.  However, I think it is odd that so many atheist aren’t skeptical of their government.  Just like the religious often wall off an area of their thoughts from skepticism, it seems the same applies to many atheists when it comes to government.

It is also unusual that atheists oppose a one-size-fits-all top down approach for morality from a “benevolent” deity, yet are often ready to embrace a one-size-fits-all top down approach from a “benevolent” government.  I think the Founding Fathers had a healthy skepticism of government.  I think they understood one-size-doesn’t-fit-all for government, which is why we have a federal government, not a national government.  Despite this, it appears that often atheists seem to want government to be the mechanism or tool to achieve their view of social good.

I am not suggesting a particular outcome.  I think some government is good and necessary.  Just like questioning faith, it isn’t about convincing someone there is no god, it is about questioning their process for coming to that conclusion.  I think it is good to always be skeptical of more government doing more good.

Along those lines, perhaps we should ask ourselves why it is fair that rich people don’t have to pay more for shoes or a hamburger, yet we think it is "fair" that the rich should to pay more to consume their healthcare, or government.

- Jared

On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:57 PM, Jared Reeves <[address removed]> wrote:

Colette,

I agree that corporations and (our) government are generally answerable to the public in different ways.  However, I am not sure I agree that they are incomparable.  What do you mean that they are incomparable, because there seems to be many comparisons of which I could think? 

- Jared

On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:49 PM, Colette Gabrielle <[address removed]> wrote:

I'm not implying anything. I'm saying that corps and gov are answerable to the public in different ways. They're not comparable. I agree, both are accountable to the people but in vastly different ways. Unless we consider that politicians are in bed with corporations... 

On Jan 29, 2016, at 4:39 PM, Jared Reeves <[address removed]> wrote:

Colette,

Great questions.  You seem to imply that collective financial will is inferior to voter will.  However, your example doesn’t seem to support this conclusion.  I don’t think it matters how a corporation “really” feels (although there are numerous examples of companies making decisions in part based on its values, such as diversity).  Motives are difficult to prove; and in the end, I think results are what really matter. Just like I don’t think it matters if a politician votes for a bill simply because s/he wants to get re-elected and doesn’t really care about the bill.  Both institutions are accountable and both often do what is in their own best interest, regardless of social good.

- Jared

On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 4:22 PM, Colette Gabrielle <[address removed]> wrote:

  "Which institution do you think is more answerable to a collective will, corporations or government?"

Corporations are obligated to collective financial will. Money speaks. If the consumers stop purchasing a product, the company is forced to change or go out of business. Prime example: Barbie just announced a new line of barbies with different body shapes (curvy, petite, and tall) and 7 skin tones. Do you think they *really* care about inclusivity and diversity...? Or do you think they recognize that the new generation of parents buying gifts for their children care about these social issues?

Government is answerable to voter will. Ultimately, if you don't vote and/or pester your lawmakers/elected politicians, then you'll never influence policies.

Colette

> On Jan 29, 2016, at 1:40 PM, Jared Reeves <[address removed]> wrote:
>
> Which institution do you think is more answerable to a collective will, corporations or government?



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