Re: [rlccef] Is It Just Me?

From: Roger G.
Sent on: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 12:01 PM
Frank,
I suspect Hallmark won't be making any contractual offers to either of us, but that aside;

If I'm not mistaken, August 30, 2012 is the deadline for a nominee and a candidate must be declared BY that date. If the race is close, a decision must be arrived at by the republican party as to who their candidate will be, by that date. The court of public opinion may well have made the decision before that, which I believe is the case now. The public doesn't see a close race between Romney and Ron Paul. A majority of the public have, arguably, already made up their minds, if not FOR Romney, they've already decided AGAINST Dr. Paul. 

I fully agree, and have said often, that Ron Paul has some very good ideas that I agree with - I would also support the adoption of those ideas by Romney, or any other candidate, as a good idea is "good" on its own merit, and not good because of who holds it. I think it is more plausible to think Romney would adopt some of Ron Paul's ideas than to think Ron Paul will get the nomination and the election, and implement those ideas himself. 

It is my belief that the primary objective in this election is, simply, to defeat Obama. We must eliminate Obama, the most destructive problem we have, before we can work on repairing the damage Obama has done. Any and all candidates, except Gary Johnson, would be a better option than Obama. So, we must support the candidate with the best chance of defeating Obama. This election is not a choice as to who any of us think is a good candidate. It simply comes down to who we think can beat Obama. 

If Freedom is to survive, we must defeat Obama. Ron Paul just is not in a position to make that happen at this time, or by August 30.

Have a good day at work - I'm off to Boynton Beach to hear Tom Trento in a debate this evening.
Best Regards,
Roger 







On Aug 21, 2012, at 11:14 AM, Frank Zilaitis wrote:

Roger,

The reality is that Romney is not yet the nominee.  I have already effectively made a suggestion to Pat regarding what can be done before we head into the battle otherwise known as the General Election.  (I have also taken the time to "compete" with your recent poem via my "My Masters" masterpiece. :))  I simply do not want to roll over and play dead until Thursday, August 30, 2012.

The epiphany is that, after a study of the records of Romney (the Obamney Care commercials starring Tim Pawlenty are coming) and Ryan (let's distract the folks while we kick the can to 2030 and beyond, it appears that the only candidate OPPOSITE of President Obama is Ron Paul in our camp.  If we do not have the guts to nominate Dr. Paul, let's alternatively insist that Romney/Ryan adopt the Ron Paul Plan.  It is bold and courageous and, if the Romney/Ryan team will not consider running with it, then we should expect merely less of the same in a Romney/Ryan administration.  I do not want the same, more or less, Roger.

I want the freedom to survive as my own master following a quick government fiscal implosion, not some insane rot-on-the-vine socialist/communist scenario touted by the folks upset by the capital karma but unable to perform. :)  On my calendar, we have until next Thursday to alter the course of history.  In the meantime, I am getting back to work.

Give me liberty or give me death. . . at my own hands and not at the hands of my masters.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 10:54 AM, Roger Gangitano <[address removed]> wrote:
Frank,
You ask if anyone will join you in reality. The reality is; There are only 77 days days left before we head to the polls. Is there ANTHING new about Ron Paul that the American voter hasn't already heard - Something that would cause an epiphany and a surge of support for Dr. Paul? I just can't believe that, at this point in time, anyone expects a sudden  Ron Paul to rise in the polls, surpass Romney, and continue to gain enough support to beat Obama. 

Did I read your comment correctly? Did you say that you, under any circumstances, would be "content to see President Obama taking full responsibility for imploding the federal government from a fiscal perspective and doing it quickly."? I'm not content with Obama remaining in office under any circumstances, and I'm not willing to risk a second Obama term by trying convince the public that Ron Paul can win.

Let's ALL join together with a reality check. There are only 77 days left until this election. We need to support the front runner to defeat Obama, not try to convince the public to back Dr. Paul, when they have NOT supported him in sufficient numbers as yet. What would cause them to support him now? 

Like it or not - That's the reality of our situation. 77 days.... Including today, and it's already 10:30am. The candidates are rounding the last turn with Dr. Paul, Gary Johnson, and the rest of the starting contenders far behind with no chance of catching the leaders... It's a two-man race at this point and Romney and Obama are all alone, neck and neck, as we come into the final stretch with only 77 days left to go! This one looks like it will be a photo-finish, folks, and Ron Paul is NOT in the picture. Sorry to say - THAT is reality. (And my poor imitation of a guy calling a horse-race!)

77 days.  .... and counting down.

Roger





On Aug 21, 2012, at 9:39 AM, Frank Zilaitis wrote:

Somehow I missed the news on Ron Paul's withdrawal as a candidate for the Republican nomination Len.

Again folks, are we operating within the rules or with a mob mentality.  I am getting concerned that I am going to have to cave and purchase a copy of Arguing with Idiots.  Can someone tell me who wrote that book?  But wait a minute, maybe I do not want to read it if the author was an atheist, or a Ron Paul fan, or a Democrat, . . .?  I digress.

:)

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 9:14 AM, Len Lemmer <[address removed]> wrote:

The Ron Paul candidacy is over. If you want to begin a Ron Paul 2016 campaign, have at it. I hope that we still have elections in four years.

On Aug 21,[masked]:17 AM, "Frank Zilaitis" <[address removed]> wrote:
Thank you Pat for sharing your perspective.

First and foremost, your comment about shouting from the sidelines is a bit harsh considering my track record with the Republican Party I chose to join in 2009 after having had no party affiliation for my entire life.  But I will get over your insult if that's what you meant it to be.

I am also really tired of folks ignorantly labeling me a Ron Paul fan.  Over the past two or three years, thanks to intellectuals like Scott Ellis and Matt Nye, I have learned that I am an Objectivist.  If you read any of my campaign materials for state committeeman, you would not have leveled yet another insult.

From an Objectivist point of view, it is irrational (not to mention disrespectful) to ignore laws (constitutions, statutes, rules and regulations, ordinances, etc.), if we are indeed are a government of laws and not of men.  The mob mentality I see in these threads is absolutely appalling.  It is even more alarming to see the rationalizing of Romney/Ryan that folks are doing given the circumstances.  Interestingly enough, if you read the Ron Paul Plan and compared to Romney's or Ryan's plans, you would see that we get a balanced budget inside of a presidential term.  Not in 2030 or 2040.  So, from a logic and reason perspective, I do propose that, since Ron Paul is the only candidate left in the Republican Party with the plan that is opposite of President Obama's and Romney/Ryan's plans, it is indeed time to make one last sanity check Pat.  Otherwise, I, personally, am content to see President Obama taking full responsibility for imploding the federal government from a fiscal perspective and doing it quickly.  I do not want a rationalist Republican in the big chair in 2013 and then see the Republican Party get destroyed over a longer term.

The movie I have seen was 2008 starring John McCain and Sarah Palin.  The ending was real bad for Republicans, because they failed to walk the walk in the land of principles.  I joined the Republican Party in  2009, because I still believed it was possible to work within the Party to bring about the change I wanted to see and the change I thought folks who are members of the Tea Party, 9-12, Space Coast Patriots and other groups wanted to see.  Perhaps I am mistaken?

President Obama is possibly the most principled politician of all time. (I am wearing my flak jacket today. :))  He appears to be a collectivist and is using every ounce of his energy to make sure the United States of America continues down that path toward communism.  Amazingly, Speaker John Boehner lead the charge in the most recent raising of the debt ceiling last summer.  At this moment, I am reminded of the title of a book former Chrysler Chairman Lee Iacoca wrote years ago?  Where have all the leaders gone?

Can anyone join me in reality?  Or should we just continue to watch movies until the U.S. Government fiscally implodes?

On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 5:26 AM, Pat Pasley <[address removed]> wrote:
Frank,
There is no doubt that you have always been a Ron Paul supporter and I admire your loyalty to him.

But, this country went through an election were the majority of people voted for Romney.  There were
some other very good candidates, but they also were rejected.  What I did notice was that Ron Paul always had
the least amount of votes with I think the exception of one state.

I am very curious as to what you propose we should do.  Should we reject Romney/Ryan and demand that
Ron Paul be the candidate?  Do you really believe at this late date that Ron Paul would be elected President? 

This country is at the brink of going under.  If you have seen the movie 2016, you understand that Obama was
just getting started in his first term.  He will finish the job of destroying us if he is re-elected.

Many of us are coming off a primary election that was exhausting work.  But the November election
is right around the corner and we understand what is at stake.  What we need are more supporters
that will roll up their sleeves and join us....not just shout from the sidelines.    We could use your energy
in helping us. 

We are working hard to save this country not only for ourselves but for you and your family as well.

Pat






On 8/20/[masked]:36 PM, Frank Zilaitis wrote:
Is it just me or is anyone else concerned that Republican state parties are spending money on Mitt Romney's campaign before we have formally nominated him?

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-08-20/romney-raised-40-million-last-month-for-presidential-run 

Or is it time to ignore our own party rules, shut up and support the presumptive nominee?

Frank Zilaitis





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