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RE: [humanism-174] "God's Warriors"

From: sylvie w.
Sent on: Saturday, August 25, 2007 12:47 PM
I enjoyed the program very much.

Marni Tiborsky <[address removed]> wrote:
Ok, here?s what really stood out for me as I watched this program in absolute disgust and horror. I agree with Mark?s first sentence totally:
?Vain, narrow-minded, gullible, ignorant humans... this is what I would call the "typical" Religious Right of the last 25 years?
What really scared me was the fact that so many people can be brain-washed by so few. I?m sorry if this sounds harsh, but I wanted to just give practically everyone I saw on that program a glass of Kool-aid! And if the fundamentalist Isreal-loving congregation wants to free the Jews from the likes of Iran, then go for it ? OVER THERE!!!! Leave America out of it. Ugh.
What Jimmy Carter stated about the ?new? Baptist movement scared and angered the crap out of both of us. Turning the clock back to when women had no rights? What is up with that? Ridiculous!
I agree with you, Maude, the Evangelical minister who voiced his concerns about how religion and government have become too fused together was pretty heartening, but sad to know it?s so true. For him to believe in the separation of church and state though, especially when it?s so obvious he is very much a god-loving Christian, is very refreshing. And it says a lot that even though he lost 1,000 people from his congregation, he gained a thousand more after his six ?The Cross and the Sword? sermons.
The fact that we?re raising impressionable children into this is reprehensible to me. Wow, say that fast five times J
I think that when we have our meetup at our place in September, that anyone who didn?t see that show, should watch it. We?ve taped it (obviously), and I think it might be a very good idea. It gets the blood boiling.
My biggest thing is how are we going to fight this? I thought we needed to bring in some big guns ? lawyers, scientists, anybody we can think of, to get the courts to see reason. There has to be a large body of freethinkers, atheists, agnostics, or what-have-you, who are willing to be ?warriors? on the side of enlightenment.

From: [address removed] [mailto:[address removed]] On Behalf Of Maude
Sent: Friday, August 24, 2007 1:34 AM
To: [address removed]
Subject: Re: [humanism-174] "God's Warriors"
I have to say I learned a couple things I didn't know, I was horrified by much, heartened by a few things, and it made me ponder one big question as it relates to religion and politics in this country.
**For those sitting near me at the meetup this week-the above is my point-the dissertation follows (grin)**
The one big question about religion and politics in this country that occurred to me while watching the series is, why on earth do these people feel a need to hook their "moral"/political issues to religion? Why not just organize a group of all people wishing to lobby against abortion, or gay marriage, or for the defense of Israel and then go forth and lobby in the political arena? I think they actually hurt themselves by bringing their religion into it. Certainly there must be atheists and agnostics and other freethinkers who oppose abortion for other moral reasons, who oppose gay marriage for societal reasons, and who want to defend Israel for strategic reasons. I think it ridiculous that these political causes have to be hooked to religion. At the same time I think abortion and gay marriage should not be under the domain of government but are in the realm of free choice but since they are political issues now......why do they need the religion involved in it?
I was quite pleased to see the one evangelical pastor put forth environmentalism as a cause even though, he hooked it to religion. It says so in the bible-is his reason for getting people involved-but from hearing him speak, I also suspect there is a side of him that recognizes that it is just the plain common sense thing to do in order to make life easier for our grandchildren and their grandchildren.
I was interested to listen to Jimmy Carter and was heartened by that also. I remember his presidency and I remember thinking at the time that he wore his faith on his sleeve and I thought it inappropriate at the time. But considering what we have going now in government, his take on religion and politics was actually a relief. Which points out to me how much more tolerant I have become if that long ago I thought he was religiously extreme! So, the religious right has maybe even brainwashed me in a way. Something for me to think about.
Couple things I didn't know-that there are fundamentalist xtians vehemently supporting Israel financially and politically to that extent, and that fundamentalist Islam opposes ANY secular government. Interesting.

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