Plato of Athens (Reading group, meeting #1)

Dear Philosophers of Kingston,

I will be running a new reading group from August-October (1 meeting per month, for 3 months) in Lake Ontario Park on Robin Waterfield's book Plato of Athens: A Life in Philosophy. This read will be a bit more challenging (but also rewarding) than some of the shorter books we have read. Basically you have to be curious about/interested in Plato and life in Ancient Greece as it is a deep dive into Plato's life.

The book is available from amazon.ca here. Hardcover is $30, paperback comes out in July for $22.

For our first meeting in August we will cover:

• Introduction
• The Sources
• 1. Growing Up in Wartime Athens
• 2. The Intellectual Environment

From the publisher's description of the book:

• The first ever biography of the founder of Western philosophy
• Considered by many to be the most important philosopher ever, Plato was born into a well-to-do family in wartime Athens at the end of the fifth century BCE. In his teens, he honed his intellect by attending lectures from the many thinkers who passed through Athens and toyed with the idea of writing poetry. He finally decided to go into politics, but became disillusioned, especially after the Athenians condemned his teacher, Socrates, to death. Instead, Plato turned to writing and teaching. He began teaching in his twenties and later founded the Academy, the world's first higher-educational research and teaching establishment. Eventually, he returned to practical politics and spent a considerable amount of time and energy trying to create a constitution for Syracuse in Sicily that would reflect and perpetuate some of his political ideals. The attempts failed, and Plato's disappointment can be traced in some of his later political works.
• In his lifetime and after, Plato was considered almost divine. Though a measure of his importance, this led to the invention of many tall tales about him-both by those who adored him and his detractors. In this first ever full-length portrait of Plato, Robin Waterfield steers a judicious course among these stories, debunking some while accepting the kernels of truth in others. He explains why Plato chose to write dialogues rather than treatises and gives an overview of the subject matter of all of Plato's books. Clearly and engagingly written throughout, Plato of Athens is the perfect introduction to the man and his work.

Video interview with the author:

# Who Was The REAL Plato of Athens?

Hope to see some of you there. Please be sure to bring a lawn chair, and head towards the sheltered area with the bathrooms, we will be sitting behind that structure under a tree.

Cheers,
Colin

*** UPDATE INFORMATION
Plato of Athens (book summary and questions for meeting #1)
Waterfield presents Plato as “the first Western thinker systematically to address issues that still exercise philosophers today in fields such as metaphysics, epistemology, political theory, jurisprudence and penology, ethics, science, religion, language, art and aesthetics, friendship and love… In effect, he invented philosophy…. [understood] as an ongoing quest” (p. xxi)
Later he notes that Plato was not just important, but rather “super-important” (xxiii)
Growing up in wartime Athens, especially the constant battle between Athens and Sparta, had a profound impact on Plato’s views of the Athenian experiment with democracy. Populist appeals for power swayed Athenian citizens to support invading the island Sicily, home of the powerful city of Syracuse which was an potential ally of Sparta. This was a disaster for Athens, as they lost 40 000 men. The plague, coupled with failed miliary campaigns, reduced their military to a third of what is was once, and Athens was financially insolvent. Other provocations with Spara sealed Athens fate that it would never return to its previous glory days as the dominant city-state in Greece.
“In his teenage years then, Plato was living in a city that was sunk in gloom and the certainty of defeat. When he was born Athenians could still claim to live in the wealthiest and arguably the most powerful state in the Greek world; by the time he came of age; its financial resources had been drained and it had been humbled by defeat. It must have been both depressing and terrifying” (5).
People only wanted to increase their own power, not what was good for the city.
Personal Characteristics
“As a child Plato was studious and literary pretentions, and as an adult he was wealthy, snobbish and religious” (33).
2 events of his day profoundly impacted his political philosophy-
(1) the cruelty of the Thirty Tyrants, an oligarchy imposed by Sparta after Athens fell to them that lead to a bloody purge of 1500 Athenians being killed (a year later Athens was regained and the Thirty Tyrants defeated)
(2) Socrates being sentenced to death for corrupting the minds of young Athenians
The Sophists
The sophists were rivals to Socrates and Plato. They were expert public speakers/debaters who charged a fee to the wealthy to teach them how to argue more effectively, so they could sway an audience to accept their position. Two years ago we did a reading group on Bo Seo’s book Good Arguments, and I paste below his summary on rhetoric as it might stimulate some discussion:
Chapter 4: RHETORIC
Seo describes the disagreement between Socrates and Gorgias concerning the value and function of rhetoric (the art of persuasive communication). Socrates gives the example of a doctor and rhetorician when it comes to medicine. The former has knowledge about what will actually treat the health malady of the patient, whereas the latter may just engage in flattery, impressive words and a confident speech to convince the masses to consume some fake elixir to cure the health malady. For the critics of sophistry like Socrates, rhetoric is shallow and pretentious speech, imprecise and irrational. We should instead engage in “straight talk”, with “no spin”. Seo responds that rhetoric has a legitimate and important place to play in argument, because of the apathy and biases of the listener. Getting someone to change their mind, or revise their beliefs, is hard to do. “HOW” a debater conveys their message is just as important as WHAT they convey. One’s mannerism, tone and pace, moving the listener by appealing to their emotions, etc. are all important aspects of rhetoric and winning an argument contends Seo.
Waterfield contends (p. 45) that Plato’s primary disagreement with the sophists was two-fold:
(1) their teaching methods treated the student as a passive recipient of information vs active co-searchers after knowledge
(2) their assumptions and arguments did not deepen understanding of political and moral issues, but rather were focused on the narrow end of being successful in the context of current politics and morality.
Socrates
Plato was around age 16 when he met his teacher and mentor Socrates, who was in his early 60s. The relationship lasted 8-9 years before Socrates was put to death.
Some questions for the group to consider:
#1. Plato’s philosophical development was profoundly shaped by Socrates, his mentor. Does anyone stand out in your own personal life (e.g. parent, friend, teacher), as a formative intellectual influence that encouraged you to think critically and autonomously versus simply accept the dogma and beliefs of society?
#2. Plato was a critic of democracy, and this was shaped by the poor qualify of decisions taken by Athens and the sway of populist sentiments. Political leadership exploited rhetoric, rather than exemplifying qualities like reason and knowledge. What do you think about this critique of democracy?
#3. What role, if any, do you think rhetoric should play in democratic dialogue and debate?