Plato’s Laws, Book II: Harmonizing the Souls in Justice and Virtue

Plato’s Pod podcast continues its extended series of discussions on Plato’s longest dialogue, the Laws. In this meeting, we will read Book II, which builds on what we learned since we began with Book X and followed it with Book I. (Note this and the next meeting are 1 week each later than the normal schedule which will resume after.)

The dialogue's three characters are an unnamed Athenian, Clinias from Crete, and Megillus from Sparta. Throughout the Laws they discuss an ideal constitution for a new Cretan colony to be called Magnesia, with Clinias in its leadership. Reason will be foremost in the constitution designed to cultivate virtue among the citizens, unlike the laws of other cities which are designed for war.

In Book X, we saw the gods equated with reason in the universal soul, and each of our souls has a share in the soul of the universe. In Book I, we heard that virtue in citizens is necessary to govern their pleasures and pains peacefully. In our last meeting, we considered the similarity between the word “happiness” in the U.S. Constitution and Magnesia’s goal of “virtue," and how the U.S. framers defined “happiness” as the "pursuit of virtue,” not the pursuit of personal pleasure as happiness is thought to be today.

This very different view of happiness is a key message of Book II, where we see a focus on harmony and unity in representation, which together form the basis for the Just life.

As Book II says at 663(c): “…our ideas of justice and injustice are like pictures drawn in perspective. Injustice looks pleasant to the enemy of justice, because he regards it from his own personal standpoint, which is unjust and evil; justice, on the other hand, looks unpleasant to him. But from the standpoint of the just man the view gained of justice and injustice is always the opposite.”

As we read the Laws and try to make sense of its logic and principles, it may help to recall the following among the principal elements of Plato’s perspective on universal logic: every physical thing comes to be from a cause, the universe is spherical, the universe itself has a soul, there is a universal distinction between infinite Being and limited representations of being in Becoming, the universe consists of both the visible and the invisible, the soul consists of three parts (reason moderating the other two which are need and desire), knowledge exists in a divided line, and the Forms are the means of universal definition.

All are welcome to participate in the discussion, although please relate your comments to Plato’s text. To get the most from the session, participants should read the selection from the dialogue in advance, a free version of which is available online at http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Plat.+Laws+1&fromdoc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0166.

You can listen to the entire library of the podcast, now in its 4th season, at https://rss.com/podcasts/platospod/ or on your favourite podcasting platform. The recording of our previous meeting will be posted a few days in advance of this session.

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BEFORE THE MEETUP: Please visit https://1drv.ms/u/s!AqvPwkIofv4UaFldrPpbva3VSXI?e=3Y7PjP for selections from the text that will be reviewed at the outset of the discussion, as well as questions that we will aim to address in our discussion. You can also find there as questions and themes that we explored in our previous meetups on many of Plato’s other dialogues. Before each meeting we will update this link with some questions and material for discussion. Our meetings will generally be scheduled every two weeks on Sunday at 4 p.m. eastern. During our dialogue on the dialogue, participants are encouraged to relate their comments to Plato's text, making reference to the Stephanus marginal number for the passage so the rest can follow in the reading.

There are many translations of Plato’s works available, and your public library should have multiple editions in print or e-book format. Participants with a particular interest in Plato might be interested in purchasing Plato: Complete Works in e-book or print (https://www.amazon.ca/Plato-Complete-Works/dp/0872203492/), which is the source we quote in the podcast series.

Whether new to or experienced with Plato, all are welcome to the dialogue and to sharing in the discovery and learning.

This Meetup will take place on Zoom. Please RSVP to access the Zoom link at your Meetup Account.