Plato’s Philebus: Memory, Knowledge, and Limits (Part 1, to 27(c))

Which is better: the life with all knowledge but no pleasure, or the life of pure pleasure but no knowledge? Early in Plato’s Philebus, Socrates and Protarchus put both lives on trial and reach the verdict that, neither being desirable, the best life is a combination of both. The question then becomes the extent to which either should contribute to the mixture.

It’s a question that, posed by Plato 2,400 years ago, may have a particular relevance today, as the power of our technology offers the potential for vast quantities of both knowledge and pleasure. How do we choose the extent of each in the lives that we lead? We’ll explore the question of proportion in the first of three podcast discussions on Plato’s Philebus, covering to 27(c).

As in many of Plato’s dialogues, we are confronted by the challenge of whether ‘man is the measure of things’. Socrates leads both Protarchus and Philebus to a universal basis of measurement for all things, which involves the logic of numbers and their connections. He places the form of the good in the middle of it all, as the equivalence by which both knowledge and pleasure are rightly measured in their combination. We might ask whether we do so too, in balancing our choices between knowledge and pleasure.

In our own dialogue, we can explore the philosophical, mathematical, and geometric bases for measurement that Plato sets out. We’ll begin by examining Socrates’ statement in the Theaetetus, that “there is nothing which in itself is just one thing”. Is this correct and does it apply to knowledge and pleasure, or was Socrates missing something? As we explore Socrates’ assertion that each thing consists of a combination of limits and the unlimited, we can also revisit Plato’s other dialogues as they relate to knowledge of ‘things’ – when things are defined as “objects of thought.” The conclusion of the Parmenides was that “if the one is not, nothing is.” The Cratylus explored the limits that define the beginning and end of any one thing and differentiate it from any other thing. In the Greater Hippias, Socrates causes the sophist to move the limits of the thing called “fine” to the point of illogic. Where do we tie down the logic, in the combination of limited and unlimited that we and every other thing comprise – if Socrates is to be believed?

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Our discussion will be recorded in voice only without video, using first name as it appears on your screen profile, and broadcast on the “Plato’s Pod” Podcast for those who would like to share in our knowledge. We can go anywhere the group wishes, for which some suggested themes will be offered. Wherever our discussion leads, Plato, without a doubt, would have imagined no better way than in dialogue for knowledge – the account of the reasons why – to multiply its connections. We welcome the sharing of all perspectives, whether you are new to or experienced with Plato. Recordings of previous episodes of the Plato’s Pod podcast are at https://open.spotify.com/show/53Zvjr7avMylQgNqfqBxlk?si=7b50d100bfc4474d and other podcast platforms.

After the podcast recording ends in two hours, participants are welcome to remain for “Plato’s Café”, a casual half-hour discussion of your choice of themes from any of Plato’s works, or philosophy in general.

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THREE DAYS BEFORE THE MEETUP: We will post questions and themes for discussion on a shared drive for participants at https://1drv.ms/u/s!AqvPwkIofv4UaFldrPpbva3VSXI?e=3Y7PjP, where you can also find topics explored in our previous meetups. Our meetings will generally be scheduled every two weeks on Sunday at 2 p.m. eastern. During our dialogue, participants are encouraged to relate their comments to Plato's text, referring to the Stephanus number for the passage so others can follow in the reading. Participants are also encouraged to read the text aloud for the meaning of the written word to resonate.

There are many translations of Plato's works available, of varying quality. Your public library will have multiple editions. A free translation of the Philebus is available on Perseus at http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0174%3Atext%3DPhileb. Participants in our entire series might be interested in purchasing Plato: Complete Works (https://www.amazon.ca/Plato-Complete-Works/dp/0872203492/).

The Meetup will take place on Zoom. Please RSVP to access the Zoom link at your Meetup account.